diff --git a/packages/internal/src/index.js b/packages/internal/src/index.js
index 2313cb3d5f5..c8e36af48ef 100644
--- a/packages/internal/src/index.js
+++ b/packages/internal/src/index.js
@@ -8,5 +8,8 @@ export * from './utils.js';
 export * from './method-tools.js';
 export * from './typeGuards.js';
 
+// eslint-disable-next-line import/export -- just types
+export * from './types.js';
+
 export { objectMap } from '@endo/common/object-map.js';
 export { fromUniqueEntries } from '@endo/common/from-unique-entries.js';
diff --git a/packages/internal/src/types.d.ts b/packages/internal/src/types.d.ts
index 45b3dbf4dc3..e54952e4ab2 100644
--- a/packages/internal/src/types.d.ts
+++ b/packages/internal/src/types.d.ts
@@ -1,4 +1,7 @@
 /* eslint-disable max-classes-per-file */
+import type { Callable, RemotableBrand } from '@endo/eventual-send';
+import type { Primitive } from '@endo/pass-style';
+
 export declare class Callback<I extends (...args: unknown[]) => any> {
   private iface: I;
 
@@ -18,3 +21,37 @@ export declare class SyncCallback<
 
   public isSync: true;
 }
+
+/**
+Returns a boolean for whether the given type is primitive value or primitive type.
+ 
+@example
+```
+IsPrimitive<'string'>
+//=> true
+ 
+IsPrimitive<string>
+//=> true
+ 
+IsPrimitive<Object>
+//=> false
+```
+ */
+export type IsPrimitive<T> = [T] extends [Primitive] ? true : false;
+
+/** Recursively extract the non-callable properties of T */
+export type DataOnly<T> =
+  IsPrimitive<T> extends true
+    ? T
+    : T extends Callable
+      ? never
+      : { [P in keyof T as T[P] extends Callable ? never : P]: DataOnly<T[P]> };
+
+/**
+ * A type that doesn't assume its parameter is local, but is satisfied with both
+ * local and remote references. It accepts both near and marshalled references
+ * that were returned from `Remotable` or `Far`.
+ */
+export type Remote<Primary, Local = DataOnly<Primary>> =
+  | Primary
+  | RemotableBrand<Local, Primary>;
diff --git a/packages/internal/src/types.js b/packages/internal/src/types.js
new file mode 100644
index 00000000000..d382eb5feaf
--- /dev/null
+++ b/packages/internal/src/types.js
@@ -0,0 +1,2 @@
+// Empty JS file to correspond with its .d.ts twin
+export {};
diff --git a/packages/internal/test/types.test-d.ts b/packages/internal/test/types.test-d.ts
new file mode 100644
index 00000000000..9b63697ac33
--- /dev/null
+++ b/packages/internal/test/types.test-d.ts
@@ -0,0 +1,23 @@
+import { expectNotType, expectType } from 'tsd';
+import { E, ERef } from '@endo/far';
+import type { Remote } from '../src/types.js';
+import type { StorageNode } from '../src/lib-chainStorage.js';
+
+const eventualStorageNode: ERef<StorageNode> = null as any;
+const remoteStorageNode: Remote<StorageNode> = null as any;
+
+{
+  // When awaited, ERef makes the object look local
+  const storageNode = await eventualStorageNode;
+  expectType<StorageNode>(storageNode);
+  expectType<string>(storageNode.getPath());
+}
+
+{
+  // When awaited, Remote is correct
+  const storageNode = await remoteStorageNode; // no-op
+  expectType<Remote<StorageNode>>(storageNode);
+  // @ts-expect-error cannot call remote methods directly
+  storageNode.getPath();
+  expectType<Promise<string>>(E(storageNode).getPath());
+}
diff --git a/packages/orchestration/src/examples/stakeAtom.contract.js b/packages/orchestration/src/examples/stakeAtom.contract.js
index 4c87f855f74..ff189ee10d4 100644
--- a/packages/orchestration/src/examples/stakeAtom.contract.js
+++ b/packages/orchestration/src/examples/stakeAtom.contract.js
@@ -3,6 +3,7 @@
  */
 
 import { makeTracer, StorageNodeShape } from '@agoric/internal';
+import { TimerServiceShape } from '@agoric/time';
 import { V as E } from '@agoric/vow/vat.js';
 import { prepareRecorderKitMakers } from '@agoric/zoe/src/contractSupport';
 import { InvitationShape } from '@agoric/zoe/src/typeGuards.js';
@@ -22,8 +23,8 @@ export const meta = harden({
   privateArgsShape: {
     orchestration: M.remotable('orchestration'),
     storageNode: StorageNodeShape,
-    marshaller: M.remotable('Marshaller'),
-    timer: M.remotable('TimerService'),
+    marshaller: M.remotable('marshaller'),
+    timer: TimerServiceShape,
   },
 });
 export const privateArgsShape = meta.privateArgsShape;
diff --git a/packages/orchestration/src/examples/swapExample.contract.js b/packages/orchestration/src/examples/swapExample.contract.js
index 8fca312ecd3..ac63c9c75bd 100644
--- a/packages/orchestration/src/examples/swapExample.contract.js
+++ b/packages/orchestration/src/examples/swapExample.contract.js
@@ -1,4 +1,5 @@
 import { StorageNodeShape } from '@agoric/internal';
+import { TimerServiceShape } from '@agoric/time';
 import { withdrawFromSeat } from '@agoric/zoe/src/contractSupport/zoeHelpers.js';
 import { Far } from '@endo/far';
 import { deeplyFulfilled } from '@endo/marshal';
@@ -10,7 +11,7 @@ import { orcUtils } from '../utils/orc.js';
  * @import {Orchestrator, IcaAccount, CosmosValidatorAddress} from '../types.js'
  * @import {TimerService} from '@agoric/time';
  * @import {LocalChain} from '@agoric/vats/src/localchain.js';
- * @import {ERef} from '@endo/far'
+ * @import {Remote} from '@agoric/internal';
  * @import {OrchestrationService} from '../service.js';
  * @import {Zone} from '@agoric/zone';
  */
@@ -18,10 +19,10 @@ import { orcUtils } from '../utils/orc.js';
 /** @type {ContractMeta} */
 export const meta = {
   privateArgsShape: {
-    localchain: M.any(),
-    orchestrationService: M.any(),
+    localchain: M.remotable('localchain'),
+    orchestrationService: M.or(M.remotable('orchestration'), null),
     storageNode: StorageNodeShape,
-    timerService: M.any(),
+    timerService: M.or(TimerServiceShape, null),
     zone: M.any(),
   },
   upgradability: 'canUpgrade',
@@ -40,10 +41,10 @@ export const makeNatAmountShape = (brand, min) =>
 /**
  * @param {ZCF} zcf
  * @param {{
- * localchain: ERef<LocalChain>;
- * orchestrationService: ERef<OrchestrationService>;
- * storageNode: ERef<StorageNode>;
- * timerService: ERef<TimerService>;
+ * localchain: Remote<LocalChain>;
+ * orchestrationService: Remote<OrchestrationService> | null;
+ * storageNode: Remote<StorageNode>;
+ * timerService: Remote<TimerService> | null;
  * zone: Zone;
  * }} privateArgs
  */
diff --git a/packages/orchestration/src/examples/unbondExample.contract.js b/packages/orchestration/src/examples/unbondExample.contract.js
index 86e11a98c6a..ff2beac44d0 100644
--- a/packages/orchestration/src/examples/unbondExample.contract.js
+++ b/packages/orchestration/src/examples/unbondExample.contract.js
@@ -6,7 +6,7 @@ import { makeOrchestrationFacade } from '../facade.js';
  * @import {Orchestrator, IcaAccount, CosmosValidatorAddress} from '../types.js'
  * @import {TimerService} from '@agoric/time';
  * @import {LocalChain} from '@agoric/vats/src/localchain.js';
- * @import {ERef} from '@endo/far'
+ * @import {Remote} from '@agoric/internal';
  * @import {OrchestrationService} from '../service.js';
  * @import {Zone} from '@agoric/zone';
  */
@@ -14,10 +14,10 @@ import { makeOrchestrationFacade } from '../facade.js';
 /**
  * @param {ZCF} zcf
  * @param {{
- * localchain: ERef<LocalChain>;
- * orchestrationService: ERef<OrchestrationService>;
- * storageNode: ERef<StorageNode>;
- * timerService: ERef<TimerService>;
+ * localchain: Remote<LocalChain>;
+ * orchestrationService: Remote<OrchestrationService>;
+ * storageNode: Remote<StorageNode>;
+ * timerService: Remote<TimerService>;
  * zone: Zone;
  * }} privateArgs
  */
diff --git a/packages/orchestration/src/facade.js b/packages/orchestration/src/facade.js
index ed507e4ab77..c905534ca18 100644
--- a/packages/orchestration/src/facade.js
+++ b/packages/orchestration/src/facade.js
@@ -6,7 +6,7 @@ import { E } from '@endo/far';
  * @import {Zone} from '@agoric/zone';
  * @import {TimerService} from '@agoric/time';
  * @import {LocalChain} from '@agoric/vats/src/localchain.js';
- * @import {ERef} from '@endo/far';
+ * @import {Remote} from '@agoric/internal';
  * @import {OrchestrationService} from './service.js';
  * @import {Chain, ChainInfo, OrchestrationAccount, Orchestrator} from './types.js';
  */
@@ -15,7 +15,7 @@ import { E } from '@endo/far';
 const anyVal = null;
 
 /**
- * @param {ERef<LocalChain>} localchain
+ * @param {Remote<LocalChain>} localchain
  * @returns {Chain}
  */
 const makeLocalChainFacade = localchain => {
@@ -134,11 +134,11 @@ const makeRemoteChainFacade = name => {
  *
  * @param {{
  *   zone: Zone;
- *   timerService: ERef<TimerService>;
+ *   timerService: Remote<TimerService> | null;
  *   zcf: ZCF;
- *   storageNode: ERef<StorageNode>;
- *   orchestrationService: ERef<OrchestrationService>;
- *   localchain: ERef<LocalChain>;
+ *   storageNode: Remote<StorageNode>;
+ *   orchestrationService: Remote<OrchestrationService> | null;
+ *   localchain: Remote<LocalChain>;
  * }} powers
  */
 export const makeOrchestrationFacade = ({
diff --git a/packages/orchestration/src/service.js b/packages/orchestration/src/service.js
index be46cdd0288..84905922962 100644
--- a/packages/orchestration/src/service.js
+++ b/packages/orchestration/src/service.js
@@ -12,6 +12,7 @@ import {
 
 /**
  * @import { Zone } from '@agoric/base-zone';
+ * @import {Remote} from '@agoric/internal';
  * @import { Port, PortAllocator } from '@agoric/network';
  * @import { IBCConnectionID } from '@agoric/vats';
  * @import { ICQConnection, IcaAccount, ICQConnectionKit } from './types.js';
@@ -21,7 +22,7 @@ const { Fail, bare } = assert;
 
 /**
  * @typedef {object} OrchestrationPowers
- * @property {ERef<PortAllocator>} portAllocator
+ * @property {Remote<PortAllocator>} portAllocator
  */
 
 /**
diff --git a/packages/vats/src/types.d.ts b/packages/vats/src/types.d.ts
index 6369ae6a5b7..ec9ecc84191 100644
--- a/packages/vats/src/types.d.ts
+++ b/packages/vats/src/types.d.ts
@@ -1,8 +1,7 @@
+import type { BridgeIdValue, Remote } from '@agoric/internal';
 import type { Bytes } from '@agoric/network';
 import type { PromiseVow, Remote } from '@agoric/vow';
 import type { Guarded } from '@endo/exo';
-import type { ERef } from '@endo/far';
-import type { BridgeIdValue } from '@agoric/internal';
 
 export type Board = ReturnType<
   ReturnType<typeof import('./lib-board.js').prepareBoardKit>
diff --git a/packages/vats/test/vat-bank.test.js b/packages/vats/test/vat-bank.test.js
index aff6065e622..e23468725ce 100644
--- a/packages/vats/test/vat-bank.test.js
+++ b/packages/vats/test/vat-bank.test.js
@@ -9,7 +9,7 @@ import { subscribeEach } from '@agoric/notifier';
 import { buildRootObject } from '../src/vat-bank.js';
 
 /**
- * @import {Remote} from '@agoric/vow';
+ * @import {Remote} from '@agoric/internal';
  * @import {BridgeHandler, ScopedBridgeManager} from '../src/types.js';
  */
 
diff --git a/packages/vow/src/index.js b/packages/vow/src/index.js
index d3033e6933f..4b41d02b15a 100644
--- a/packages/vow/src/index.js
+++ b/packages/vow/src/index.js
@@ -5,3 +5,6 @@ export { VowShape, toPassableCap } from './vow-utils.js';
 
 // eslint-disable-next-line import/export
 export * from './types.js';
+
+// XXX re-exporting the Remote type for back-compat
+export * from '@agoric/internal/src/types.js';
diff --git a/packages/vow/src/types.js b/packages/vow/src/types.js
index ac7a94bcf56..974e28bb796 100644
--- a/packages/vow/src/types.js
+++ b/packages/vow/src/types.js
@@ -5,10 +5,10 @@ export {};
  * @import {RemotableBrand} from '@endo/eventual-send'
  * @import {CopyTagged} from '@endo/pass-style'
  * @import {RemotableObject} from '@endo/pass-style';
- * @import {PromiseVow, Remote} from '@agoric/vow';
+ * @import {IsPrimitive, Remote} from '@agoric/internal';
+ * @import {PromiseVow} from '@agoric/vow';
  * @import {prepareVowTools} from './tools.js'
  */
-/** @typedef {(...args: any[]) => any} Callable */
 
 /**
  * @template T
@@ -21,29 +21,6 @@ export {};
  * @typedef {T | PromiseLike<T>} ERef
  */
 
-/**
- * @template T
- * @typedef {(
- *   T extends bigint ? true :
- *   T extends boolean ? true :
- *   T extends null ? true :
- *   T extends number ? true :
- *   T extends string ? true :
- *   T extends symbol ? true :
- *   T extends undefined ? true :
- *   false
- * )} IsPrimitive Whether T is a primitive type.
- */
-
-/**
- * @template T
- * @typedef {(
- *   IsPrimitive<T> extends true ? T :
- *   T extends Callable ? never :
- *   { [P in keyof T as T[P] extends Callable ? never : P]: DataOnly<T[P]> }
- * )} DataOnly Recursively extract the non-callable properties of T.
- */
-
 /**
  * Follow the chain of vow shortening to the end, returning the final value.
  * This is used within E, so we must narrow the type to its remote form.
@@ -57,16 +34,6 @@ export {};
  * )} Unwrap
  */
 
-/**
- * A type that accepts both near and marshalled references that were
- * returned from `Remotable` or `Far`.
- * @template Primary The type of the primary reference.
- * @template [Local=DataOnly<Primary>] The local properties of the object.
- * @typedef {Primary | RemotableBrand<Local, Primary>} Remote A type that
- * doesn't assume its parameter is local, but is satisfied with both local
- * and remote references.
- */
-
 /**
  * @template [T=any]
  * @typedef {object} VowV0 The first version of the vow implementation